Short rant about how OP Ashi's are ...

[ruminator]

I was playing Ports v Japan and found that veteran cassies don't actually counter veteran Ashi's very well!

With CIR I had an attack of 51, but the Ashi's due to their upgrade cards in age 2 and a consulate had a whopping 47 attack!! I built the direct counter and they matched me 1:1 (better armour balanced by their OP HP). Due to OP shrine eco I was then unable to reinforce as quickly and eventually lost - ashi's being cheaper than cassadores!

While I know I made a load of mistakes, 20 cassies v 20 HI with CIR researched should be a win for the Cassies! I know I should have used the better range with hit and run, but they just marched straight into my base and I needed to garrison settlers first.

Rant about OP Ashi's over ....

[Hydrovert5]

Hopefully after the fan patch, they were nerfed.

(Never read the patch specs)

[djdan]

They were the problem is, not many people have the patch up to about 2nt Lt level so getting any rated games below 1st lt is difficult

[ruminator]

Fan patch reduces their base attack from 26 to 24 - so their attack would still be about 44-45 in my scenario. Key change is the nerf to their shrine eco so they will hopefully not be as spammable.

I hate losing to someone who can beat me by spamming only one unit, even if they are otherwise better than me ...

[Tubruk]

[quote=""ruminator""]Fan patch reduces their base attack from 26 to 24 - so their attack would still be about 44-45 in my scenario. Key change is the nerf to their shrine eco so they will hopefully not be as spammable.

I hate losing to someone who can beat me by spamming only one unit, even if they are otherwise better than me ...[/quote]

nah all the improvements/techs have been nerfed, aswell as shrine eco. consulate daiymo etc. only boost 10% rather i think (not sure on figures but i know its a decrease of 5% per tech, and advanced arsenal techs cant be used til industrial so they will hit mid/high 30s at most.

[Sporting_Lisbon]

Yeah, dl the fan patch

[Aaryn_GenD]

lol you didn't play on the fp man.
consulate only gives 5%, golden pavillon only 10%, likem entioned the base attack, shogun tokugawa gives only 10% hp boost, plus the HUGE nerf on shrines.

so plz don't complain

[huGGy]

Caesár still knows how to play japan on an op level -.-

[GeneralMichael]

Wow skirms losing to muskets never thought I would see or hear the day... well not counting that one treaty battle where my ashi's beat my opponents skirms. I forget what they were called just remmeber it was indian skirms. I remmeber this battle cause he was using only skirms and when I sent in a bunch of calv to kill them he switched to melee and due to they outnumbering my calv and that one card that upgrades India's infantry hand attack, my calv got slaughtered. Fortunately Japan is not OP at my sergeant level in rush games. Also I don't think anybody at sergeant level has the patch other than the ones in our clan.

[ruminator]

I am definitely going to d/l FP this weekend. However, I am concerned how many Mst Srg/2nd Lieut players have the patch as well. Anyone who has been spamming Japs for the last 6 months is unlikely to be getting the patch any time soon!

[scoop10]

well im a srg ive only had i 1 rated game which was a 2v2 with a clan member (cant remember who) so its a case of just playing clan games on fp then switching back over to get a few rated games in, but theres a lot that dont want to ply fp they must love spamming ashis

[Kaiser_von_Nuben]

Well, you've identified the main problem with pre-patch ashis: They can counter their theoretical counters. Ashis have beaten my German skirms many times as long as they have at least the same number, and every time if they outnumber me.

They make up for their "HI" tag with their immense base attack and numerous card/Asian wonder/daimyo upgrades. Plus they are faster than skirms (4.5 vs. 4) and they have a faster ROF. Taken together, that's bad news for skirms. And it's even worse for xbows, which have lower RR, lower HP, lower range and lower attack. 5 ashi >> 5 xbow. And you can't hit-n-run ashis too well, since they gain on you with superior speed.

Fan patch will solve some of these problems, but the speed issue is still there. And although the consulate/Wonder boosts have been nerfed, they still have a 15% attack boost card in Age 2, and a 10% HP boost card in Age 3, which also makes them stronger against cav. They are still a formidable unit. You just need to kill Japan ASAP.

[deadhanddan]

[quote=""Kaiser_von_Nuben""]Well, you've identified the main problem with pre-patch ashis: They can counter their theoretical counters. Ashis have beaten my German skirms many times as long as they have at least the same number, and every time if they outnumber me.

They make up for their "HI" tag with their immense base attack and numerous card/Asian wonder/daimyo upgrades. Plus they are faster than skirms (4.5 vs. 4) and they have a faster ROF. Taken together, that's bad news for skirms. And it's even worse for xbows, which have lower RR, lower HP, lower range and lower attack. 5 ashi >> 5 xbow. And you can't hit-n-run ashis too well, since they gain on you with superior speed.

Fan patch will solve some of these problems, but the speed issue is still there. And although the consulate/Wonder boosts have been nerfed, they still have a 15% attack boost card in Age 2, and a 10% HP boost card in Age 3, which also makes them stronger against cav. They are still a formidable unit. You just need to kill Japan ASAP.[/quote] +1

[BenS64]

Imo there is no normal way, to harras a japan player, therefore I think you must get the tc down asap. This is pre fan patch btw.

[Kaiser_von_Nuben]

[quote=""BenS64""]Imo there is no normal way, to harras a japan player, therefore I think you must get the tc down asap. This is pre fan patch btw.[/quote]

You can do this even more effectively now. Have I told you about the new Landsknecht/uhlan rush I've been toying with :twisted: